Episode 2 of Inciting A BrewHaHa finds us talking about Fake Flowers, Fake Stones, and other crap that's fake...

Also, we discuss correspondences.

Big shout outs to Gillian of Iron Powaqa Radio and Kathleen of Borealis Meditation!

Contact the show by emailing IncitingABrewHaHa@gmail.com.


  • Echo

    This was a great segement! It brought up some really interesting issues and you both brought wonderful points to the table. During your debate I remembered an old science experiment from gradeschool and thought it might have some relevance to this discussion.

    It’s common knowledge that florists use vegetable dyes to change or add color to flowers. (Vegetable dyes are natural not synthetic, just as heat is natural and not a synthetic way to change stones) As a kid, I remember changing the color of a carnation by putting vegetable dye in a container of water and putting a white carnation into it. The plant drew the water up and the flower would become the same color as the dye in the water. My point being, it didn’t change the essence of the plant, only it’s color and appearance. It was still a white carnation, only now it appeared to be blue because I manipulated it to look that way.

    Likewise, you can change the color of an amethyst using a natural method (heat) but it’s essence would seem to basically be that of the original stone just as that of the daisy or carnation retains the essence of the original flower regardless of how the florist can manipulate and change it’s color. The only difference in citrine and amethyst is that iron becomes oxidized in citrine due to the heat. The iron is still there and present in both stones, chemically they are basically identical, with the same crystal structure and same hardness scale that geologists use when examining stones. So is Citrine like the carnation that has been manipulated to change to a different color? Is it the same in it’s original essence, just different in appearance? One of those questions that may never have a satisfactory answer.

    For me personally, specifically for magical purposes; I prefer stones in their raw natural state, in their original color and form, straight from the ground. No human manipulation applied to them, that includes cutting, tumbling, polishing, heat treating, etc. It’s just my personal preference. Just as using a real flower (preferably one that I have grown myself or picked in the wild) as a spell ingredient matters to me, it matters that I’m using the original stone that nature created, not one that has been manipulated by humans.

    It’s a very fine line in the difference between nature creating an object or man manipulating that creation for the sake of changing it’s appearance. Different in essence? As you both showed by example, it depends on who you ask.

    Keep up the great work, love the individual and joint podcasts you do because they make me think. Kudos to you both.

    Aug 22, 2010 at 2:41 pm
  • Nathan

    Going back and listening through the archives. Great stuff!

    About opposite correspondences: There’s a hermetic principle about polarity that basically puts forward that opposites are actually the same thing, but only differing in degree. So when you find an object, flower, stone, etc., that historically have opposing correspondences, they may actually not be contradicting one another, but merely able to be used at different degrees of the same thing.

    An exercise: sit with the item in your left hand in a place where you can relax and close your eyes. Tell yourself in your mind to see the energy flowing out of the item into you. Literally say in your mind “See the energy flowing from it into you.” Then say in your mind (or out loud) one of the correspondences and then see what comes up. Then take a deep breath and relax. Then say the correspondence that you feel contradicts the first one. See what comes up. Then take a deep breath and relax. Then go back to the first one. Go back and forth saying them, seeing what comes up, and relaxing until your confusion drops away.

    The likely result is that either you’ll figure out which correspondence you can “tune in” with more easily or you might find that the contradictory things are actually the same and you’ll have no blockages in the use of the item in either way.

    That’s just me coming first from an esoteric/ceremonial background before my interest in nature based spirituality.

    Sep 28, 2011 at 9:29 pm
  • SilverIsis

    I found this discussion interesting in that you both had very strong perspectives on natural vs. artificial given that even in your discussion that you admit there are many shades of gray. The things that came to mind to me is 1. Candles are one of the cornerstones of magic and yet unless you are making your own tallow candles, there is little in them that is natural. Even if you used an organic soy or palm candle made with essential oils, there are several chemicals such as stearic acid or colorants that are not natural which unless you are making the candle yourself you would have no clue that they are in there. In spite of this there are many state that you can put energy into these. 2. I myself have felt energy emanating from my grandmother’s costume jewelry, which is all fake stones. I think that we limit ourselves when we say that only the natural has genuine/pure power that can be accessed.

    Oct 5, 2011 at 4:53 pm

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